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Hi All,

I've read dozens of posts on a number of message boards from desperate individuals hoping to get through detox with the least amount of withdrawals. I decided to post my findings on the matter in an attempt to help those of us afflicted with addiction and especially those of us who are facing a lengthy and painful withdrawal. 

I'm not going to go into a lot of detail about my personal story, if anyone is interested just click on the search icon in this site and query: Subutex My Story, and my detailed history will come up as the first link. I will say however, that I was addicted to a number of prescription opiates and chose to get on Suboxone and later Subutex to prevent withdrawals from my DOC (drug of choice). I've been on Subutex/Suboxone for nearly a year, until early last week that is. From what I've read, along with my own experience, most doctors (even well meaning ones) will place an addict on entirely too many Subs and often for too long of a time. I was started on three 8MG Sub's per day for a total of 24MG's. In retrospect I probably could have started on 4MG's and still have avoided all of the withdrawals from the 15 or so 10MG Norco's (Vicodin) I was taking on a daily basis. But I'm an addict so I followed my Dr.'s advice even though I knew better. 

I started self-weening from the Subs about three months ago. I went from 24MG's to 16, to 4, and then down to the 2MG pills. Once and a while, being the addict that I am, I would have days where I wanted to feel the little euphoria one can experience when drastically upping your dose but I didn't do this very often. When I finally decided to get this rather large monkey off of my back I began a more strict taper. 2MG's per day for one week, then 1MG per day for one week, then .5MG's per day per one week and finally .25MG's for TWO weeks. I took my last dose on Monday July 30th, 2012. I went to the store that day to stock up on the over the counter supplies I'd need to ease the two weeks to one month withdrawal I had ahead of me. Note: I have an executive job and I don't have the luxury of sick days. Not to mention KNOW ONE in my family has any idea that I'm an addict or that I was taking any medication let alone Subs. All of our lives are different and I respect many of you who have a support system in place such as friends and family. I don't have that option nor do I choose to, it is my belief that I got myself into this mess and I have to get myself out. 

With that said I need to function at the highest level possible so I've taken some rather controvercial steps many of the old-schoolers or purists on this site wouldn't agree with. It's my firm belief that each one of us are wired differently and have various levels of responsibilities so please, I don't want to hear how I'm "doing it all wrong". I'm writing this simply to as an example of how a withdrawal from Subs can be done without incurring too much pain or without destroying your career or family life. It' been working for me and it might work for others. 

So here is my supply list and my detailed regimen since last Monday. Some of what I'll write here my not be available to everyone but I was fortunate enough acquire everything on this list which has helped SIGNIFICANTLY, in fact I'm writing this from my office and have not missed one day of work or a single high-level meeting. 

First the OTC supplies: 1.Bottled Water (lot's and lot's of water to flush out your system, drink at least 8 bottles or so a day) 2. Atkins Chocolate Delight Shakes (these are expensive but nutritious as your appetite disappears), 3. Atkins Chocolate Granola Bars (these are loaded with calories and protein and are fairly easy to eat even when you're not hungry) 4. Centrum Multi-vitamins, 5. Potassium Vitamins (this helps with Restless Leg Syndrome, RLS, which is a horrible byproduct of any opiate withdrawal), 6. B-6 Vitamin (this will help you recover at least a little energy), 7. Magnesium Vitamins (not exactly sure what this does but I've read on a number of forums that it helps with WD's), 8. Omega-3 Fish Oil Vitamin (helps your body with badly needed minerals), 9. Vitamin C (helps your body stay healthy because the last thing you want is to get a flu on top of the WD's). 10. A various assortment of lean cuisine microwavable meals (it's vitally important to eat and clean out your system and these are fairly healthy and better yet simple to make when you have absolutely ZERO motivation). 11. Some fresh fruits that are easy to eat i.e.: Blueberries, Strawberries and Bananas (the latter has a ton of potassium as well) 12. Melatonin Vitamin (This is a natural element your body creates to help ease you into sleep and you will really want to get at least a couple of hours a night of sleep while going through the WD's so I highly recommend getting a 5MG bottle and taking at least 2 a half hour before bed time).

I wish the above list were it but it's never that easy. I've also had to take the following prescription medications: 1. Soma (this is a muscle relaxer I take only at night to help me sleep and prevent muscle spasms), 2. Tramodol 50MG's (this is an opiate-like medication with a much lower classification and fairly easy to purchase online or get from your Dr. NOTE: Tramodol IS addictive so be very careful on how much you take and for how long. It does take longer to develop an addiction to Tramodol than it does to full agonist opiates but be VERY careful you don't want to trade one addiction for another. I would limit the use to 2-3weeks MAX and no more than 400MG's per day!!!) 3. Hydrocodone 5/325 (these are relitively mild opiates and you should also limit the use to when you absolutely need them and for NO MORE than 2 weeks! Also, you MUST wait a minimum of 3 days from your last Sub dose before you take this medication. Despite some rumors out there, taking Hydro's soon after taking a Sub will NOT put you into precipitated withdrawals but the Hydro will be waisted as the Subs bond to your opiate receptors more strongly than do the Hydro's or any other opiate for that matter. Where the precipitated withdrawal takes place is when someone has an opiate habit and takes a Sub before they are in full withdrawal, DO NOT DO THIS!

My Daily Routine Morning: I wake up around 5 AM for work and by the time I wake up all of the vitamins and prescription meds have lost their effect so I feel all of the symptoms of a mild withdrawal. BTW: Don't drink coffee because this will add to the withdrawal anxiety. I drink an Atkins shake first thing in the morning with all of the vitamins listed above including 200MG's of Tramodol and 2 of the Hydro's. After I finish the shake I open a bottle of water and eat on the large Atkins bars to pad my stomach from all of the vitamins and pills I'd just taken. Within a 1/2-1 hour the WD symptoms begin dissipating and you're able to function. Remember there is NO WAY other than taking a super powerful opiate and getting addicted all over again to get through any withdrawal 100% painlessly so you will have to deal with some discomfort. For me it's typically some mild to mediocre anxiety and RLS but I have been diagnosed with GAD (General Anxiety Disorder) which probably plays into it a lot. NOTE: Notice I didn't include any benzo's (AKA: Xanax, Valium) in my regimen like so many others do even though I'm sure they would help. The reason being is that those drugs are also highly addicted and unlike opiate withdrawal, benzo withdrawal CAN BE LETHAL so why play with fire in my opinion? I also started a light workout this last weekend to get my endorphins going, I can't stress how important even an initial 10 mins of exercise can be in the healing process. You're not going to want to do anything but this is a vital step to a quicker recover...no pain no gain has a whole new meaning here. Then a nice, hot, long shower before leaving for work. (WATER, WATER, WATER)

My Daily Routine Afternoon: I'm still feeling okay by the early afternoon although often my anxiety gets elevated and so does my feeling of depression and lethargy. I take two more Tramodol's for a daily total (up to the afternoon) of 300MG's and then I'll take ONE of the Hydro's. I will feel mildly uncomfortable for the remainder of the day but I've been productive at work and most important to me know one is the wiser. I also have a full meal, something light but filling. The Trams will help the bathroom issue and even though I'm going more often that usual, it's not nearly as bad as it could be. (WATER, WATER, WATER)

My Daily Routine Evening: I get home and immediately make something significant to eat like a lean cuisine, and a bar and shake. Yes you're going to feel rather full and most likely you didn't want to eat what you just ate but the body NEEDS the nutrition. After I eat I get in bed in some comfortable, breathable clothing and watch anything mildly entertaining on the boob tube. Right before bed I take another potassium pill to reduce the nighttime RLS, 2 Soma's, 2 Melatonin s and the final two Tramodol's for a daily total of no more than 400MG's.

LAST NOTE: I saved one 2MG Sub for the midpoint of my detox and took a quarter of it last Friday while I was experiencing the worst of the WD's. This seemed to help a great deal.  

Once you get through week two you drastically start tapering the prescription meds, especially the Trams and Hydro's. By the beginning of week three you will have jumped over the worse of the Sub WD's and although you'll be left with some discomfort you have avoided the worst of it without getting addicted to the prescription meds listed above. This is my 7th day of this routine and it's helped incredibly. I hope this helps those of you who are currently suffering through a horrible withdrawal or those of you who are about to start. God bless!

P.S.
I'll update everyone on a daily if not weekly basis until I'm out of the woods. Please send me a private message or post if you have any questions or comments. Thanks everyone and good luck!

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A lot of what you said is very true and Everything you said makes sense, but nothing I seemed to buy helped with any of my withdraw symptoms, I even ordered WithDraw Ease off the internet, they made it sound like the cure all with their testimonials and after weeks of research. It ended up being a crock of *&%^ and a large waste of money......$170.00. I too was on suboxone for over a year, 4-8mg tabs a day when in reality, I could have gotten by with 4mgs and then down to 2mgs within a month or so. Yes these Dr's over prescribe the subs and they are just as addicting as the drugs themselves, sometimes worse. I would rather go through WD off vics or percs anyday than to go through WD off the subs. Now I have reached the herion point and that my friend, is no joke. No suboxone is going ease the WD symptoms of herion WD. I am seeking a methadone Dr now (that's actually how I found this site, I started reading and could relate to a lot of what most everyone had to say.) My story is long and complicated, but there was a time when I would't even take aspirin for a headache. Long Story. I have to get off here for now though and I wish each and everyone of you that suffer from addiction and WD a safe healthy, happy recovery!!! Warm Wishes to Everyone!!!
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Hi Ann,

I wish I could force you NOT to take methadone because I made the same mistake 4 years ago. I have never done "street" drugs and only became addicted to prescription opiates after tearing a muscle in my lower back. I obviously continued to take way too many pills even after the pain was gone. I was looking for a way out of my daily pill routine when I stumbled on methadone. To make a long story short (if you want to read my whole tale then click the search icon and query: Subutex my story, and mine will be the first link) I started on the methadone program with 40MG and soon was up to 90MG's per day. I decided I had to quit this after about a year. I had gone through what I can only describe as "mild" withdrawals from my pill habit whenever I ran out. At that time I had nothing else to compare it to so the withdrawals were the worst thing I'd ever experienced either psysically, emotionally or psychologically. That was until I went cold turkey off of 90MG's of Methadone....

I thought the methadone withdrawals would be similar to the pills with being immobile for a week or so until I started to feel better. I had even planned ahead, got the vitamins, Gatorade and a week off work. I don't want to scare you, I really don't but I do want to warn you! I didn't get out of bed for a month, and that is no exaggeration! I went through the most painful withdrawals anyone can imagine. I had even visited an addiction Dr. who prescribed be the Clonopin, Xanax and Subutex. NOTHING worked, after day 3 I thought I was going to die, after week one I was scared I wouldn't die, after week two I thought I was going crazy, after week three I couldn't imagine or take anymore pain and then finally one day I was able to get up. This was in December during Christmas and it was by far the most horrendous experience of my entire life. Methadone has the longest half-life of ANY opiate and trying to kick Methadone will be one of the toughest ordeals any individual can experience. It will test your body, spirit, soul, mind, heart, and brian to the limits and beyond.

Please understand that I'm not saying any of this to freak you out but instead to hopefully warn you before you have to experience what I've gone through. I would take Subutex and Oxy withdrawal at the same time rather than take another Methadone withdrawal THAT"s how bad it was. Remember, I did this for few months so maybe if you are on a 28 day program it will be a lot better but I don't know from experience. I do know it's always best to taper as quickly as possible before an addiction develops and you definitely DO NOT want to get addicted to Methadone.

If there is ANYTHING I can do to help you please let me know, even if it's just chatting online or answering any questions I can. Just please be careful, I wouldn't wish what I went through on anyone. I hope to hear from you soon and maybe you can elaborate a little more on how long and how much Methadone you take. Thanks and good luck if I don't hear from you!

Warmest Wishes,
-R
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Hi Ann,

I re-read your post and Suboxone/Subutex will 100% help you with heroin withdrawals! I am not speaking from experience but I have read numerous posts from heroin addicts who swear by Subs. There are a number of downsides with subs and one of the first being that you have to experience significant withdrawals from you DOC BEFORE you take a Sub or you will go into precipitated withdrawals which is a normal withdrawal x's 10. This happened to me a week after quitting methadone (it was still in my system) and taking a sub which was HORRIBLE. Anyway thought I would share that with you before you decided whether or not to start the Methadone treatment.
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Update Day 7 of Detox Day 4 of Zero Subs

This morning is my Day 4 of absoloutely ZERO Subs and like many of you have written it is the start of the toughest portion of the withdrawals. I've been keeping the same routine (listed on my first post above) with the addition of 2 OTC Benadrils last night which I substituted for the 2 50MG Ttamodols I have been taking right before bed time.

I slept decently through much of the night although I did wake up every couple of hours to urinate (I've been drinking massive amounts of water and protein shakes to clear out my system). When my daily alarm went off at 5:00AM I felt an immediate and fairly potent anxiety attack. I also felt extremely uncomfortable in my own skin. I also had a pretty vicious headache.

After waking up I grabbed an Atkins chocolate shake and a handful of vitamins (again, listed above if anyone is interested) and downed everything with a few swigs of my shake. Along with the vitamins I took four 50MG Trams for a total of 200MG's and two 5/325 Norco's. I laid in bed watching a couple of episodes of The West Wing until I has to start getting ready for work at 7:00. I'm able to work from home today since I have to knock off early for my GF's b-day (UGH, last thing you want to do is go hangout with a bunch of happy people) but I HAVE to do it for her. BTW: if you haven't read any of my earlier posts my addiction is a BIG secret and know one knows other than you fine people.

I feel better than I did three hours ago but I'm still writing this from sitting atop the old porcelain thrown if you know what I mean.

Well gotta run, keep strong everyone and God bless!
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A quick note....

I think it's important to describe some of the withdrawal feelings in as much detail as possible. Something that's helped me a great deal has been reading hundreds of posts from folks from all walks of life that are experiencing the same thing I am. Remember this is my only external support outlet as know one in my life; friends, family or significant other knows what I'm going through nor what I've been through.

I think one of the toughest aspects of withdrawal is the dreaded time. It seems to be the number one question out there; "how long will this last", "when will the withdrawals be over", "when will I feel normal again", etc. I think it's different for everyone, although we are all human none of us are wired exactly the same way. I'm tough as nails when it comes to emotional issues or physical pain (such as spraining an ankle, hurting my hand etc.) but I'm a giant wuss when it comes to "internal" pain like what we experience with WD's. I've been this way as long as I can remember. Whenever I've had the flu I turn into the biggest baby. For me, withdrawals are 10fold worse than any horrible flu I've ever had. When I read Dr. testimonials of withdrawals being like "flu symptoms" it angers me a great deal. It is NOTHING like the flu. I've never had a flu where I'm unable to sleep for days, in fact often it's the opposite, when you're sick it's easy to sleep with the help of some OTC meds like Tylenol PM or Nyquil. When in WD's only strong prescription sleep aids or benzo's will do the trick and most only work for a short amount of time.

Emotionally I become really depressed and even worse than the depression is the extreme anger I feel. I'm pissed at myself and my body for putting myself through the WD's. And unlike more than a few people on here I don't blame my Dr.'s or anyone other than myself. I'm a grown man who makes his own decisions know one tied me down and forced me to take massive amounts of opiates. It often baffles me how I could be so intelligent when it comes to work yet be such a m***n when it comes to my own body, mind and spirit.

It's my GF"s b-day today as I mentioned in my earlier post and I'm waiting for her gift to arrive from Tiffany's before I drive the hour + to visit her. I have to get some work done this morning, drive to FedEx, stop at the bank, wrap her gifts, go to the flower shop, and then meet her, her parents, sister, brother, and sister in-law. I obviously have to "act" as if everything is hunky dory which is a feat in itself. I HATE having to lie to everyone, you'd think after having an opiate addiction for 6 years and lying to everyone in order to keep this rather large skeleton safely in the recesses of my closet would get easier over time but it hasn't. If you knew me you would have no idea that I was an addict. It's been exhausting keeping this a secret and NO, it isn't something I'm able or willing to come clean about. We all have different situations and KNOW ONE in my life would by okay and supportive about this. Again, it's my cross to bare, know one else's.

I don't know how much time this WD will take but my goal is to be back to at least 80% by August 20th. My GF and I are going back home (where I grew up on the east coast) for a wedding. We will be gone a week and since most of my life-long friends either still live there or are flying back for said wedding I HAVE to be back to normal, there is no other option.

It's nearly 9:00AM and I've been up since 5, I feel significantly better now that the meds and vitamins have had a chance to kick-in. Hopefully I'll feel no worse than I do now for the remainder of the day, especially since this is my GF's day and I can't let my baggage damage that. Wish me luck everyone...I'll update again soon. God Bless!
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look up the Thomas detox recipe. The L-Lysine amino acid with vitamin B-6 should help with mood and energy. It's been almost 3 days since I jumped from a taper down to .5 of sub. after being on them for 5 years.
Waiting for the worst to start soon.
Good luck!
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I am very much like you. I have a demanding career and have enjoyed success while enjoying my opiates. However, all good things must come to an end. I have never had the awful experience others describe when they are coming off Suboxone and in my opinion, the gym is the key. Anyone that forces themselves to sweat their ass off, will immediately be rewarded for their hard work. I have now been on Buponorphine for almost two years. I am about to jump again. I will have my Hydro, my Xanax and my stomach meds. I will surfer from depression but nobody promised me a rose garden...poppy fields maybe. The truth is we are all different and the reason I went back on Bupo was simply because I felt the urge to use and could not afford to lose my career or get arrested. If you taper off...and I have never made it below 4mg, you can jump. Taking the Hydro's and the Xanax are a life saver. Don't let people tell you that you are trading an addiction for another. It is all about your body, your spirit, your mind. Share as much as you can during withdrawal because the depression is what gets you. Remember the depression is temporary and your world is not falling to pieces. In fact your body is trying to trick you into giving it more of that sweet love you have been feeding it but man up....or women up. As soon as you start feeling somewhat better..say day 7 or 8, get to the gym and if you have a steam room, force yourself in. It amazes me how great I feel after a workout. Keep up the routine but do not take more than a bar of Xanax a day and after a week, shut that down. You may continue to take hydro's for two weeks but I reccomend you quit them on a Friday and take a Holiday on a Monday. The key is to not suffer. Why suffer any more than you have to when you are going through such a difficult time.

I am 45. I have done this three times and I have a wonderful wife, two great kids, a career and a wonderful life. When I am up all night I think long and hard about things and in many ways I treasure this time as it really helps me plan for my life w/o pills. When you realize you are an addict embrace it and never let your guard down. If you have to take subs or bupo again, it beats jail, heroin, Oxy or any of this new c**p out there that will steal your soul. If you ever need a friend, I will be happy to correspond. I think we all need this but I don't want self pity or p***y behavior. You win only by facing this like a man on a mission to Hell and you are planning on coming back. So thanks for sharing your method and I realize the Benzo thing is not for everyone but I agree that those things can make you a bit crazy. Although I have never felt the pain that people describe from the amount I take. Just never jump without preparation. People that do this must not have as much to lose or do during the day as I do. If you have some vacation time, use it. Make this project as easy as you can and never let anyone tell you they know the best way...only you know what works for you but I will assure you that exercise on a daily basis is a common theme from everyone I know that has survived 6 months or more w/o popping a pill. Go kick some ass!
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Hey Lifeloveandrepair,


I like the attitude you expressed in your comment, that's exactly how I feel. I think there are two types of opiate addicts; highly disfuntional, and highly functional. Thankfully I'm the latter. It's day 7 for me without any Subs and the regimine I listed above has kept my secret, my career, and my life intact. When you have everything to lose then one must do whatever one has to in order to protect both what you have and those you love. I stopped the Hydro's day before yesterday and still haven't taken an benzo's (honestly because I didn't have access to any). The only prescription drug I'm currently taking are the Tramodols which certainly help with the anxiety and depression. I had one night of crappy sleep but that's about it. I do find myself less motivated in the morning because I no longer have my morning Sub ritual but that's to be expected.


I think as long as you realize what changes are coming and prepare for them the getting off any opiate becomes more of a mind game than a physical dependency. So much of my WD's from Subs has been in my head. Each day that passes I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop from the horror stories I've read here. The only deference was that I was prepared for what was to come and it was planned instead of forced which I think makes a big impact. I tapered, purchased the appropriate vitamins and prescription meds and formulated a strategic plan. I've not missed one day of work or had any major withdrawal issues.


I think that you're right about a number of the points you made. What struck me the most about your reply was the attitude you expressed and how important it is to really man-up, take responsibility, accountability and most importantly to take back CONTROL.


I wish you the best in your upcoming detox, please contact me if I could be of any support. I doubt my 7 days is enough for me to be out of the woods but I am at the point of no return. The journey to where I want to be is shorter than the journey back to where I was.


Good luck man and let me know how it goes! I'll try to update this as much as possible becaus I think these posts help others who are struggling with similar circumstances, I know try helped a great deal in my case.


All of us have inner strength, for some it's harder to find than others but it IS there if you look deep enough.


Warmest Wishes,

-R
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Hi Lifeloveandrepair,

Well it's the beginning of day 8 and I woke up with more than a bit of anxiety this morning but that's subsided quite a bit since I first woke up. BTW: Sorry about all of the typos in my last message and this one as well but I'm writing this on my iPhone and the autocorrect doesn't always choose the correct word.

I'm going to take your advice and workout this morning. I'll do some weights and maybe some mountain biking cardio tomorrow. It's tough to get motivated but as you said know one promised a bed of roses!

Something I've discovered that may or not be obvious in regards to the anxiety: NO MORE COFFEE (at least for the next week). I typically have two shots of expresso each morning and I've been experimenting with how I feel with a morning of coffee and a morning without. I've found that the caffeine adds to the anxiety so I recommend laying off of any caffeine while you're going through withdrawals.

Anxiety is by far my worst WD symptom, I freaking despise it with a passion! And as I stated I don't have any benzo's to hide the inner anxiety although I do a fairly decent job of covering it up externally. I'm not sure I'd take any even if I had access because I've come this far without them, what's another week?

My hope: I really, really, really hope this is over by the time my GF and I go on vacation (out of town wedding) next week. It will be a week of debauchery with all of my friends (drinking no drugs) and I'll also be spending significant time with my out of state family so I have to be as close to "normal" as possible. By the time I leave it will be 17 or 18 days since I started my detox with zero subs, in your opinion and from your prior experience do you think I'll be back to normal by then? I know it's a loaded question and difficult to answer because everyone's physiology and chemical makeup are different but I was hoping to get your opinion. Thanks in advance, I'm looking forward to hearing from you.

Warmest Regards,
-R
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Wow. thank you for the helpful tips and advice- just what i have been looking for.

I am on day 7 of sub withdrawal and had it all- Freezing cold, Clammy, Hot sweats, No sleep, Restless legs syndrome, headache, Very emotional (i have cried at silly things several times this week), back pain, stomach cramps. No apetite at all. You name it, i got it!

Thru my keyworker i have been prescribed Lofexidine (not available in US) which has helped a great deal with some of the symptoms, but not all. i dont think there is any miracle cure out there to be honest!

Anyway, not one suffer, I have been online researching and researching and researching, and i decided to head to the health food shop on friday-I had to take a friend as i was terrified i would collapse on the way there (that's how weak i was). I purchased some EXTRA STRONG vitamin B12 tabs (about £8), and some multi-vits with Ginseng (about £4). I was told by the shop assistant that i couldn’t ‘OD’ on the B12 as its water soluble and will pass straight through you, so i thought great. Headed back to my office (yes, still trying to work) and took 4 (it’s supposed to be 1 a day) and took 4 of the Ginseng/ multi vits. It took a while (i took the tabs about 3pm) but by the time i got home from work about 6pm, i began to feel some semblance of normality/ energy. Wow! I even managed to wash my hair and style it (totally impossible before). I also felt a flicker of appetite! (not much, but i did manage to eat a patty)

So, I was well happy and thought ''i have found a cure!!! ''... Not so... yesterday, I woke up and felt half normal for the morning, but by afternoon i was as useless as a new born baby and i dont mind admitting that i spent most of the afternoon crying... in fact i cried so much i eventually fell asleep from the exhaustion.

Maybe because i had used up so much energy on Friday evening, it took its toll on Saturday??? i dont know...

The other things I have also found have helped me (temporarily) are-

*When i got back pain, my partner used Ylang Ylang oil. I don’t know what it was supposed to do, but it was the only one i had to hand, and he massaged it all over my back and boy did it work. Afterwards, the pain dissipated and i felt a .lot more relaxed. The difference was unbelievable. I am sure other oils will work too- you just need to research them.

*I have also burnt essential oils in a burner- lavender, lemon, peppermint, clary sage- they all seem to lift my mood in one way or another and help me feel more positive and less groggy. Essential oils can be costly, but i get mine from brilliant retailer on eBay. They cost about £2 or less for 10ml. Cant go wrong there!

*Finally, like you, I have tried to eat well. It has been hard because i have literally had to force it down i have had no apetite. But, when I do eat, its been fruit/ veg, salads and other healthy bits. Under normal circumstances, i would want pizza or Chinese, but neither of them inspired me at all, so I thought hell, if I HAVE to eat, i may as well eat healthy eh?

*Oh, and yeah, Protein Drinks. when i have found it hard to eat (the lofexidine dries your mouth and throat really bad), i have had a protein drink so i dont miss out on all my vits and minerals and end up feeling even worse.

So, those are my tips- i realise that some are the same as yours........maybe, just maybe, if i have enough energy, i can head to the shops later and stock up on some of the other bits you have suggested,

thank u sooooo much- u r a lifesaver
Hanna x
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Hi Hanna,

I'm so sorry to hear that you've had such a tough time with the Sub withdrawals. I was curious; how long we're you on the medication? Was it Subuxone or Subutex or something else with bupe? And finally, how many MG's were you on when you stopped taking the pills?

Have the withdrawals peaked for you and if so on what day? It's about 1:00AM my time (California) and its the very begining of day 9. I have a holiday planned with my girlfriend on August 21st and I'm PRAYING that I'll be back to normal by then but I won't know until a few more days pass.

I'm glad that some of what you've taken has worked for you because I know first hand how debilitating WD's can be. In 2008 I jumped from a 120MG per day Methadone addiction and I was literally in bed for a month. It was an epic nightmare and I don't wish it upon anyone. I know what you're going through now seems to be so very difficult but you to are at the point of no return. Your journey to sobriety is closer than your journey to addiction, stay strong and preserver. Please write me if I can be of any help on a support level or otherwise.

Warmest Wishes,
-R
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hey, thanks for your reply- it means a lot at this difficult time!

My story (sorry to bore everyone)- 9yrs ago, hooked up with my (now) ex, fell in love, not realising that 6 months before we met he had been released on life licence for 1st degree murder/ 15 yrs (stabbed someone to death when he was just 17yrs old during a gang robbery). Whilst he was inside he took and sold crack and heroin.

I know ppl reading this are gona think -what the f*** is wrong with u? y didnt u walk away. I mean I am not from that kinda background- i am from a well off family, i finished school and went to university, but hey, there is no point trying to defend myself now..... yeah, i was really stupid

to cut a long story short, me and him spent every second that we could together. i got onto crack and heroin big time. i was earning ok money at the time (about £35,000 per year) so could fund it at first, but as i got more and more hooked, i needed more and my wages started running out 2 wks after pay day (plus i was funding the ex and some of his mates- most of whom had raps for murder/ manslaughter, etc- yes, such a glam life- NOT)

worse, my job was affected. i stopped showing up- sometimes for days at a time. i began to sell stuff so i could buy crack and heroin got involved with some other risky things which i wont put on the WWW!!!!

it got to the point where i knew i had 2 choices- carry on taking drugs, start selling my body and become a full time crack wh*ore. OR get out NOW. I chose the latter.

I left the bf (who was emotionaly abusive) and moved out of the area of London i used to live. That was 6 yrs ago.

Yes, it was very tough, and i continued to take crack and heroin even after i left. However, over the years i managed to get off it by swapping it for subutex. i got the sub from a friend (the only one i stayed in contact with from my past, and still do). he would meet me once a week and give me the sub which he was legally prescribed by his GP,

its been about 3-4yrs since i used crack/ heroin and it made me sick last time, but the sub has been my crutch. Its a buzz and its kept me away from temptation. How much have i taken? god, its varied. Its not been a huge amount cos my friend needed his bit too! Maybe between .4 and 1mg per day?? sometimes more if i was out for an evening to keep me going.

I finally admitted my use in Dec 11 and was referred to a drug clinic. By the time I was referred i was only taking .4 but keen to get off.

My keyworker put me on a script and increased my dose. I am not sure why they did this- something about levelling me out, so they knew what i was on, then tapering me back down in a controlled way.

So, i was put up to 1.6mg at one point, which was awful. I had to take it in front of the person in the chemist but if they looked away for a second, i would spit half of it out. If i wasnt able to do that, I would feel sick ALL day. I wasnt used to putting it under my tounge- i used to snort it.

They then put me on 1.2, .8 and then .4. My keyworker told me to stop after a month or so on .4- he said i wouldnt feel anything as it was such a tiny dose, but i didnt. I didnt feel ready, so i cut my .4 into .2 and did that for a week (the week before this one just gone). it wasnt comfortable, but it was ok. However, when i admitted this to my keyworker at the end of that week, he offered me lofexidine to stop all together, so yeah, i stopped the subs on Monday and now we are on Sunday.

I dont know if my withdrawals have peaked- i have had some goddamn awful days, and some awful days.

Yesterday was bad but i think that it was more frustration after 5/6 days of it- i feel disabled. I cant go out to buy things that I need. I find it hard to walk up or down the stairs to get my meds. Right now i feel it will never end.

On Friday, after all the B12 and stuff, i saw a light at the end of the tunnel, but yesterday that light disappeared again.

I do hope you will be ok in time for your holiday with ur gf. Thats 9 days away so I am sure you will!

Sounds like u are doing all the right things, and have done your research! I just wish i had done my research before i started withdrawing (DOH!!!!).....

Hanna
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Sorry...just had a look at this- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lofexidine, which says that it takes 10 days to detox on lofexidine- so i guess i have to be patient, at least until then (thats Wednesday - seems like ages away)....

will just try hard to be strong til then...tho it feels never ending. (and i have a whole stash of subutex in the cupboard- about 15mg- i am quite proud i have stayed away!!! but it is SOOOOO tempting!!)
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Hi Hanna,

Thank you for sharing your truly difficult story, it seems as though you've come a long way and I'm proud of you as I'm sure are your family and friends. You could have continued on a certain destructive path but you chose to seek the light. Doing the right thing is not often easy but your decision shall soon be rewarded.

It's the afternoon of Day 9 and I felt a little better this morning when I woke up than I did yesterday. I have an extremely busy week at work so I hope to feel even better tomorrow. I have to be in some conferences this week including travel so it will test me.

It's strange because the entire time I've been WDing from Subs I have not been tempted to take any (since I stopped altogether last Friday). I know how you feel in regards to "time" and how slow it seems to pass when one is suffering from these withdrawals. Minutes seem like hours and hours seem like days and it feels like there is no end in sight. We all KNOW that this will pass but it's not too much of a comforting thought when you're feeling like garbage.

I also understand where you're coming from in terms of motivation or lack thereof. I'm doing a ton of laundry today (as a typical guy I hate doing this under normal circumstances and obviously more so when I have zero motivation to do anything other than what is absoloutly required).

It's important to push yourself to get out and about. Maybe try going on a short walk around the block? I know it's the last thing you want to do but excercise is KEY to recovery. It could shorten your time to "normalcy" by kicking your seratonin and endorphin production. I'm started my workout regimine tomorrow to facilitate sweating out the remaining toxins. I stop the Tramodol altogether this next Friday, 4 days before my holiday. Neither of us want to hear this but I've read about cases of Sub detox that could last up to a month or more. I don't think either of us will have to deal with that since we were both smart enough to taper before jumping off.

How are you feeling today? Any improvement it regression? In any case I hope this message finds you well and lets you know that you have a new friend across the pond who understands exactly what you're going through!

Cheers,
-R
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