Hi Katy and everyone,
My conclusion is that this is BACTERIAL VAGINOSIS of some type.
Simply an imbalance in the genital flora. That is why our tests are coming back negative for pathogens. Our vaginas consist of all types of bacteria. I believe our problems are caused by an overgrowth of anaerobic bacteria. And the irritation is being caused by the by-products of these bacteria (ammonia, etc.) (Some bacteria cause irritation and some don't.)
"The largest amounts of ammonia were generated by gram-negative anaerobes, clostridia, enterobacteria, and Bacillus spp. Gram-positive non-sporing anaerobes, streptococci and micrococci formed modest amounts, and lactobacilli and yeasts formed very little ammonia."
So the classic BV doesn't cause irritation, that's the defining factor of BV, but that is just one type of bacteria (gardnerella). There are many bacteria that can cause BV, however they are not all detectable in tests, or doctors simply don't know about them yet.
"The most frequent causative agents of these infections are Gram-negative (e.g., Bacteroides fragilis group, Porphyromonas spp., Prevotella spp. and Fusobacterium spp.) and Gram-positive (non-spore forming) bacilli (e.g., Actinomyces spp., Propionibacterium spp., Eubacterium spp., Bifidobacterium spp.) as well as Gram-positive cocci (e.g., Anaerococcus spp., Atopobium spp., Finegoldia spp., Peptostretococcus spp., Sarcina spp.)"
When a patient presents with irritation, they generally do standard tests. A Vaginitis Panel and a Genital Culture. These check for the basic and most common causes of vaginitis. And if these are negative, then the doctor says, Good news! Everything is fine.When in reality they simply don't know the cause of the symptoms.
"In clinical practice BV can be diagnosed using the Amsel criteria:[30]
- Thin, white, yellow, homogeneous discharge
- Clue cells on microscopy
- pH of vaginal fluid 4.5
- Release of a fishy odor on adding alkali—10% potassium hydroxide (KOH) solution.
At least three of the four criteria should be present for a confirmed diagnosis.[34] A modification of the Amsel criteria accepts the presence of two instead of three factors and is considered equally diagnostic."
Since it was impractical to keep going to the doctor, especially when they are not experts in diagnosing complicated vaginitis, I attempted to figure this out myself. I purchased 10% potassium hydroxide (KOH) solution myself online and did the discharge whiff test myself. It was definitely positive. I also bought PH paper and my PH is around 4.5, so hard to tell if it's normal. But it's definitely not on the higher acidic side, which is ideal. I would need a microscope to look for clue cells and/or yeast, which I was about to buy, and still might.
I would smell both fishy odor and sometimes ammonia when I did the whiff test at home. Leading me to believe that there was something in the discharge that was burning the mucous membranes (which was always what I suspected). It always felt like "acid discharge" was burning my vulva. Which was why I thought it was yeast initially.
My conclusion is that the new sexual partner, who I believe touched me with dirty hands once (i had irritation and then smelled a slightly fishy discharge after this, which was way before intercourse), initially caused the instability of the flora. I believe that the body and immune system would have been able to fight this and balance it out, however due to the onset of extreme stress (upset about the breakup circumstances, constant stress hormones (fight or flight), not sleeping or eating properly), the body wasn't able to get things back on track and ultimately caused the infection. Which then caused WAY MORE stress, continuously panicking that I had HSV2, checking my vagina 20 times a day, chronic anxiety and thinking, loss of sleep, taking antibiotic after antibiotic in an effort to fix the problem, etc.
The Clindamycin seems to have cleared the pasty white discharge that used to sit at the entrance of the vagina and cause redness and irritation. I feel that I still have some irritation because it burns when I pee sometimes, and there is slight discharge which smells fishy if I add the 10% potassium hydroxide (KOH) solution, but it is no longer burning my vulva. I think it is balancing itself out now little by little. The vulva skin is now light pink and normal, rather than red and irritated. That leads me to believe that the anaerobic bacteria have reduced, hence the reduction in the irritant in the discharge.
I am also taking daily about 15,000 mcg vitamin D, calcium 600mg, vitamin B12 5000 mcg fast dissolve chewable, 1 multivitamin, hair, skin nails gummies, and Renew Life Ultimate Flora Probiotic 25 billion live cultures. I was highly deficient in vitamin D and vitamin B12. You may not have to do this. However, I wanted to cover all my bases. I also had tons of hair loss, which is now all growing back. I now have short hairs everywhere, thank god. I ultimately do not know if stress was the cause of this entire dilemma, or if it was a yeast infection and/or BV initially. All tests were negative after taking Diflucan and Flagyl, so I will never know what the initial infection was. But it never went away completely for almost 2 years. So chronic stress and/or vitamin deficiency, coupled with tons of artificial sweetener from the Mentos Gum, could have prevented my body from healing and getting the vaginal flora back on track. It is now pretty much back to normal, so I will continue the vitamin regimen until my next doctor visit to check the levels. I also shower twice daily and dry the area well and then put Vaseline just so any moisture doesn't irritate the vulva as much. This seems to help now, as there is not as much irritating discharge as before. Now that the panic and chronic anxiety is completely gone, I think my body is now getting things in balance little by little.
I think the Clindamycin (oral capsules) killed any overgrowth of anaerobic bacteria and the Ultimate Flora Probiotic coupled with LOW-STRESS lifestyle, is finally restoring the vaginal balance of the flora. I had this idea that it would be cured overnight with the right treatment, but I guess an imbalance needs time to gradually get back to normal. Keep in mind, I took tons of antibiotics and Diflucan trying to kill this "unknown pathogen".
By the way, this was my GENITAL CULTURE result:
Gram Stain Report
No PMN observed
Moderate Epithelial cells (10-25/LPF)
Gram stain indicates altered vaginal flora. This frequently represents a transitional stage.
If signs and/or symptoms persist, repeat testing may be warranted.
*** FINAL REPORT ***
Final Report
Mixed genital flora isolated
No Neisseria gonorrhoeae isolated
This shows "altered vaginal flora". And not a specific pathogen. Adding to my theory of Bacterial Vaginosis/Vaginitis caused by an undetectable by-product from a slight increase in anaerobic bacteria, which are considered a normal part of the vaginal flora. So basically an imbalance of vaginal flora.
I hope this helps someone!! Please post your thoughts and experiences to help others who may be suffering.
Sincerely,
Adriana
It has been almost 2 years now for me too! This is unbelievable. It's very disturbing to have something wrong and not know what it is. I have heard of CVS too, but I don't think I would be ready for that yet. Especially not knowing exactly what is going on. Also check "Intracelluar Latest Yeast Infection". It's also called "chronic atrophic erythematous candidiasis". There's a video on YouTube by Eric Becker. Apparently the tissues can be infected deep inside and release toxins that irritate the area. But cultures are negative because it's not a free flowing infection. That really sounds like what I have. But it's difficult to test for and also cure.
Something interesting did happen last week though. I got a normal cold and then the vaginal problems flared up to almost how they were in the beginning. It started as a tingle in my sinuses and then sneezing, followed by sore throat and overall head congestion. But not a flu at all. Nonetheless, I started panicking about HSV2 again, since they say you feel sick when you get your first breakout. So I had that panic and anxiety like I did at the beginning and sure enough that night, it got all red and inflamed and also some additional rough feeling irritation. So I think there is a definite correlation with immune response and this problem we have. Maybe we are causing it with stress and anxiety because our body can't fight the bad bacteria, or it can't balance everything out. I've read that stress really messes with the gut flora, as well as vaginal. I have not been sleeping well since this problem either. I know that's a disaster for the immune system. Or maybe the immune response to the cold also caused it to attack whatever is going on in the vagina, assuming there is a pathogen of some type there. Or the immune response caused general inflammation in the body so it triggered the reaction in the vagina as well. Who knows. It's so frustrating trying to guess what's going on.
I notice that when I shower at night and dry it with a hairdryer and then put Vaseline and sleep enough, I wake up to a pink and almost normal looking vulva. Then as the day progresses, it starts feeling irritated, burning a little and gets red.Then the discharge sits there too. So that must mean the immune system is involved. We always get sicker toward the nighttime because our immune system is lower. You can notice this when you have the flu.
Any responses and the sharing of personal experiences are greatly appreciated!
I swore if i ever found a cure i would be first to report. I'm 34 years old and have always been an incredibly healthy individual, until 5 months ago, after some unprotected sex. Granted, i am someone who ALWAYS contracts either BV or a yeast infection after unprotected sex with someone new, but this time was different. I was not responsive to any over the counter yeast of BV medicine. No smell, minor itch, tons of discharge. It was either coming out of me like i had peed myself for half a second, thin, watery, milky.... or full on thick paste glued to my underwear, never an inbetween. Went to my dr. was tested for all STDs, cleared, was told i had a yeast infection. Prescribed 3 doses of oral 1 day tables (over 3 days). Well, i did this dosage 3 days a week for almost 3 months, nothing helped. WEnt back to my doctor, tested clear for yeast and again, all STDs they are able to test for. Discharge was still in excess, emabarrsing, and contiunus. It had alomost been 5 months of me continuing to purchase yeast tablets, cutting sugar, boric acid suppositories, ive tried it ALL! And while continuous use of these items did help a tinnnnny bit, never fully cleared. Last week, i was in desperately searing the web for answers to other sufforeres with my problem when i cam across CYTOLICTIC VAGINOSIS!!! A strain of yeast that Doctors do get results for unless specifically sought after, most of which dont even know what this is! (According to previous posts ive seen). REMEDY!!!! Legitmately!!!! Is BAKING SODA! I purchased empty gelatin capsules (size 0" ) literally stood in my kitchen with a pair of rubber clubs making my own tables, stuffing them with baking soda..... and then inserted one tablet into my V 3 times a week (do your research! doctors who know about this, also know about this remedy! though they recommend twice a week, i was despeate). I've now used 3 of my self-made baking soda pills, in addition to having a baking soda sitz bath every day for the last 5 days and i PROMISE YOU, i have had ZERO concering discharge after waking up my very first morning followoing the insertion of my first pill. If you've been tested for all STDs, BV, Yeast, and all comes up clear, i beg you to try this. My "health issue" over these last several months has ruined my sex life and also caused me to think about my vajayjay every single hour, or every single moment i went to the ladies room for 5 months. THAT IS WAY TOO MUCH TIME WORRYING! This remedy helps, and i firmly believer, after reading some of your posts, that you may benefit form this too. Do you your research and try it. It is as a result of too much GOOD bacteria, and not a lack thereof, as is the case with most yeast infections. Treating with yeast and boric acid is only doing the opposite of what you need if you have this type of vaginosis. Try it and best of luck! XO
Hi gang, I swore if i ever found a cure i would be first to report. I'm 34 years old and have always been an incredibly healthy individual, until 5 months ago, after some unprotected sex. Granted, i am someone who ALWAYS contracts either BV or a yeast infection after unprotected sex with someone new, but this time was different. I was not responsive to any over the counter yeast of BV medicine. No smell, minor itch, tons of discharge. It was either coming out of me like i had peed myself for half a second, thin, watery, milky.... or full on thick paste glued to my underwear, never an in-between. Went to my dr. was tested for all STDs, cleared, was told i had a yeast infection. Prescribed 3 doses of oral 1 day tables (over 3 days). Well, i did this dosage 3 days a week for almost 3 months, nothing helped. WEnt back to my doctor, tested clear for yeast and again, all STDs they are able to test for. Discharge was still in excess, embarrassing, and continuous. It had almost been 5 months of me continuing to purchase yeast tablets, cutting sugar, boric acid suppositories, ive tried it ALL! And while continuous use of these items did help a tinnnnny bit, never fully cleared. Last week, i was in desperately searing the web for answers to other sufferers with my problem when i cam across CYTOLICTIC VAGINOSIS!!! A strain of yeast that Doctors don't get results for unless specifically sought after, most of which dont even know what this is! (According to previous posts ive seen). REMEDY!!!! Legitimately!!!! Is BAKING SODA! I purchased empty ` capsules (size 0" ) literally stood in my kitchen with a pair of rubber clubs making my own tables, stuffing them with baking soda..... and then inserted one tablet into my V 3 times a week (do your research! doctors who know about this, also know about this remedy! though they recommend twice a week, i was desperate). I've now used 3 of my self-made baking soda pills, in addition to having a baking soda sitz bath every day for the last 5 days and i PROMISE YOU, i have had ZERO concerning discharge after waking up my very first morning following the insertion of my first pill. If you've been tested for all STDs, BV, Yeast, and all comes up clear, i beg you to try this. My "health issue" over these last several months has ruined my sex life and also caused me to think about my vajayjay every single hour, or every single moment i went to the ladies room for 5 months. THAT IS WAY TOO MUCH TIME WORRYING! This remedy helps, and i firmly believer, after reading some of your posts, that you may benefit form this too. Do you your research and try it. It is as a result of too much GOOD bacteria, and not a lack thereof, as is the case with most yeast infections. Treating with yeast and boric acid is only doing the opposite of what you need if you have this type of vaginosis. Try it and best of luck! XO
Hi ladies! As someone who has dealt with this for 9.5 years, I first contributed to this thread on page 41. I don't even remember what year that was but I have finally figured it out after years of research and trying to fix this ongoing unexplainable issue. After countless doctor visits, antibiotics, diflucan, then being told it's all in my head because my tests always came back negative for STDs, trying every supplement known to man, detoxing, and not to mention the thousands of dollars spent on specialists, supplements, recommended products to fix my incorrectly diagnosed issue. Eventually I came to the realization that it had to be something we were eating which tied all of us together with this unexplained issue. So then I tried vegetarian, gluten free, sugar free, 80/10/10, vegan, raw vegan, alkaline. Everything came with some form of relief but after a while, the issue ALWAYS came back. And I began to classify how I was feeling as my new unfortunate normal. We were so close with thinking this was Cytolytic Vaginosis and baking soda was the cure. Baking soda helps but it's temporary at best.
Ladies, we've been dealing with simply acid reflux. As crazy as that sounds if you've experienced unexplained vaginal burning, discharge especially after eating, some relief during your cycle, no long lasting relief from antibotics, diflucan, baking soda, or a million other remedies you have tried....ladies please read the book The Acid Watcher Diet by Jonathan Aviv. If you can't afford the book, just google 28 day reflux prevention and healing program which will you give you the information to get started. No pills to take, no consultation with him needed, just follow how he recommends to eat. That's it.
I don't know why doctors never correctly diagnosed me and I feel terrible for the assaults and invasive tactics I tried over the years to my vagina when it was never an issue with her. It's been what we're eating. I've had immediate relief following the guidelines outlined in the book and this is definitely what has been the issue for me. I've been dealing with this since I was 29 and I am now 38. To say this issue robbed me of my 30s is an understatement but I hope this helps someone....anyone...I have so much empathy for anyone still checking back to this thread hoping to find a solution like I have over the years.
In any case, good luck to everyone and please keep posting what has worked for you. It is definitely needed.
I've read all posts and I have exactly the same issue .. pasty white discharge, not itchy, sour taste and smell. Not yeast.
I was diagnosed with Ureaplasma, treated it with Doxycicline but the discharge always came back.
It's so difficult because I couldn't find a cure for this... please help me :(
Anne